What to Expect When Booking a Trip with Troy Pinkerton

[00:00:01] Fly Shop, And Crazy Rainbow Fly Fishing. Hey everyone, this is Blake with The Ugly Bug Fly Shop. Today we're going to be sitting down with Troy Pinkerton, Head Guide here at Crazy Rainbow and The Ugly Bug Fly Shop at the Casper Wyoming to discuss some recommendations

[00:00:29] and how to go about booking a guided fly fishing trip and hopefully answer a few of those questions that some of you may have or some uncertainty on how to go about doing that. First let's jump into a listener question.

[00:00:44] Hey Blake, I was hoping you could explain why some fisheries have productive drive-fly fishing seemingly all the time. While others like the North Platt only have specific times a year or fishing or where the fish seem to be willing to take a drive-fly.

[00:01:02] And that question is from Mark here in Casper Wyoming. Thanks Mark for a chime in and ask him. The answer to that's really the food source in which they're eating. So there's some, you know, few other factors of play like light condition, obviously low light levels,

[00:01:20] spring and fall generally lead to better drive-fly fishing. But the main reason is the food source in which they're seeing. Here on the North Platt in the spring the main diet for most of those fish are midges, rockworms, leaches, scuds, crawfish.

[00:01:41] So bugs that are living on the bottom of the river much more likely, you know, much more likely to be on the bottom of the river versus the surface.

[00:01:48] So so when we get into the fall, when you know mid summer we start seeing grasshoppers and then in the fall when we start seeing catas, big solvers, big blue wings, some drakes at times. Obviously those bugs are higher in the water column.

[00:02:04] They're hatching out and many times the spin wings are stuck on the surface at the end. So those fish are much more likely to be up looking for that food source. So depending on the river you're on obviously places like, you know, let's take the yellowstone for instance.

[00:02:23] Their main food source most of the season is catas. So those fish are always kind of looking up for the catas.

[00:02:32] So take that into account the next time you're out kind of pay attention to what's hatching or if you're really trying to look for just dry fly specific opportunity. Pay attention to hatch charts, that sort of thing and at least gives you the first step forward.

[00:02:50] Let's take a quick break here from our sponsors and then we'll jump into it. The ugly bug podcast is proudly sponsored by Fly Omen. Why Omen rooted fly fishing apparel and accessories, challenging the traditional move designed by anglers or anglers. Cool here with Troy Pinkerton.

[00:03:13] We're going to discuss kind of the do's and don'ts and process of you know,

[00:03:19] looking at trip hiring a guide kind of the routine of it and hopefully reduce a little nervousness or anxiety about about looking at trip if you're interested in hiring a guide for someone that hasn't done it before. So here answer all the new people's questions.

[00:03:37] Yeah, yeah, and maybe some of you that you know, don't have to pass and just don't you know don't quite know how the process usually works. Well kind of start you know generally most clients are doing some research kind of finding out what they're wanting to do.

[00:03:51] And I think you know a lot of the first contact either starts via email or phone call to a, you know a fly shop or an outfit or you know an independent guide whatever maybe. And generally have a few questions.

[00:04:09] I, you know very quickly tell people like it's it's your money. It's your decision. You don't need to settle for something that doesn't sound right and often and not fitting.

[00:04:20] If it sounds too good to be true, it usually is kind of too good to be true. What's your thoughts on that. I would agree with that.

[00:04:28] Yeah, if you're looking for going to get a super discounted trip, it's probably going to be a super discounted trip in every aspect. Yeah.

[00:04:37] And I think sometimes in people you know often guests or clients they want and you can't really blame them right if they want in like the entire experience right we'll get calls of people like well we really want to.

[00:04:51] And then dry fly fish and then throw streamers and then you know, and it's like well it's not really how fisheries work all the time. Now there's a few token days where that does play out but it's it's really an exception versus the norm right it's it's not all that common.

[00:05:07] Yeah. Yeah. And then most fisheries much like us have a, you know kind of distinctive seasons where you know if you're into catching fish it's probably going to more likely be nimfishing.

[00:05:18] If you're into throwing drys, you know look more towards the summer obviously the fall can often be better streamer fishing or when temps cool down a little bit.

[00:05:27] But so often when we have some you know guests call a shop, you know it kind of starts and those kind of feather questions wondering about how it all works obviously asking about pricing and kind of what goes into that.

[00:05:40] It's a little different everywhere as to what the standard is on a full day or a half day. But generally half day in most locations runs around four hours and a full day runs around eight. Salt waters a slight exception to that usually their trips are slightly shorter.

[00:05:58] Because a travel time or whatnot in the boat and because there's salt water guides and they how they roll. So it's a little different than fresh water stuff.

[00:06:10] But but definitely like when we have people call I always say like ask if you got questions ask them right that's a good time to kind of put some feelers out.

[00:06:20] And a lot of guides don't realize they can request us specific guide if they've had an experience with you or, you know someone like yourself, Troy that they enjoy fishing with they can.

[00:06:30] You know they can ask what your calendar looks like and we can find a day that you know slots someone in within within your your calendar and fits within your schedules.

[00:06:40] Yeah, and it's always nice kind of seeing those same faces because you get to know each other and then more you vibe the more fish catch. Yeah sure.

[00:06:48] Yeah makes the day and more enjoyable for everyone if there's a a little bit of a connection there and things kind of run kind of run smoothly. So so when you call an out fitter like don't don't be afraid to ask questions don't be afraid to convey.

[00:07:02] You know what you're looking for right if it's a educational sort of trip often out fitters guides. You know they know what they're good at they know what guides on their staff are good at and can often kind of. You know curate a better.

[00:07:19] Relationship between you and the guide by knowing that this guy is a better teacher than that guy or this guy is a you know.

[00:07:29] Works part time in the same profession that you work in or whatever it may be it kind of helps with the connection a little bit so.

[00:07:37] Yeah, so yeah don't be afraid to ask questions don't be afraid to like truly you know relay what you're looking for we often get a lot of family trips where.

[00:07:48] I think that's what my spring is grandson and and it's nice to know you know grandpa says like the day is not about me it's about my grand kid like that's where your focus should be it obviously.

[00:08:00] Just some kids yeah and it probably makes you know it makes someone like Troy know where to focus his attention more. And really you know in a lot of ways makes the day that much better.

[00:08:12] You know, you know some of the things that you can be easier for kids to fish with a space or numbers whatever it is. But yeah just being honest in the very beginning.

[00:08:22] Yeah, and yeah both at the time of booking but often like when you first meet the guy in the morning right where when you're getting the car and you guys have a minute to kind of bounce around.

[00:08:34] What the ideas are? I don't know what your routine is. How do you feel people out before you make a decision on where you go or how do you normally do that?

[00:08:41] Troy. Yeah, so I'll usually you know you introduce each other then you I kind of just fill out the asking straight up Hey, what are your goals for today? What do you want to see what you want to do?

[00:08:52] And I'll try to do the best my abilities right. I'll try to make their day the best it can be Is if they're realistic right, but that's first thing I always ask is like hey, what do you what is your goals for today?

[00:09:04] Like what do you want to learn to nymph? Are you just wanting to catch fish? Has never caught a fish before? Or do you want to see like a pretty part of the river, right?

[00:09:14] To into the fish and you just like hey, I want to float the river catch a few fish So I want to see something new up fish this section before So I just ask as many questions as I can in the morning

[00:09:24] I try to figure out people read them other than I go from there. Yeah So if we kind of break it down obviously you're looking at book and a trip you've done some research You've decided the outfit or you want to use

[00:09:37] Usually the process from there. You'll call email whatever to schedule a day and then once you schedule the day Generally the outfit is gonna ask for some sort of deposit to kind of hold the day Obviously every outfit has got you know minor variations in

[00:09:53] cancellations and and deposit requirements, but they're generally gonna ask for some money up front to kind of hold the day And then ask you to pay the remainder of you know the day of the trip or a couple days in advance

[00:10:08] So so when clients show up like for us they meet out at the lodge On most days when they show up in the morning Let's kind of walk them through step by step So they'd roll into the parking lot

[00:10:20] Yeah, yeah, go ahead right on so yeah, you come right you can show up Especially for fish with us. You're gonna go in Go into that if there's an office or a shop or something go in and check with them

[00:10:34] Don't just run out to a bunch of dudes by their boats and be like hey who am I fishing with? Unless you didn't know if you don't know them for sure Then go check in then you'll kind of clock in

[00:10:45] You know pay whatever fees you gotta pay you could check out the shop maybe buy a hat And Lori, you know in our lodge. She's awesome She's gonna line you out on anything you need

[00:10:57] Then she says hey you're fishing with so and so you're gonna go meet them Yeah, and so you know from there you go out You know introduce yourself whatever talk to the guide often if you got gear

[00:11:09] That's the time they're gonna ask for it kind of pre-reg it or get it ready and then Kind of walk you through you know what the day's gonna look like so so you guys loading up

[00:11:20] We kind of went over that you genuinely asking them some questions feeling them out a little bit often then You're gonna call in your shuttle for those of you don't know most companies Basically hire a service to move your truck from the put-in to the takeout

[00:11:34] We always joke and guide random guide questions of like people think the river flows on a circle or they think You know, they think we're gonna back row it all the way back up to the put-in and can get back to our vehicle

[00:11:47] So generally there's a shuttle service that'll drive the rig downstream to the takeout That'll be there when you get down so Some most of the time the guides gonna decide where they're going

[00:11:58] Before they launch a boat right. They're gonna know where the takeouts at can call in the shuttle and then then Then you get to you know have fun go fishing sort of thing

[00:12:07] So yeah, and I'd say when you first get there too. I'd just be completely honest with your guide Let them know your experience levels You know there every fisheries different so maybe fish once and you know boesmen

[00:12:20] Now you're coming to North Platt and you know, oh well and boesmen this how I did it It's like well, this isn't boesmen. You know, this is Wyoming

[00:12:27] So you're gonna fish a little bit different style and I just be open up to like learning that and like seeing you know We're all professionals on this river We know we fish it every day

[00:12:37] Yeah, we all want to throw dry flies but sometimes it just doesn't work like that Yeah, so I just be really honest with them on your experience levels Your expectations and they'll do the best to their abilities to make it happen. Yeah

[00:12:50] And I think at times clients will get a little hesitant on you know asking questions and and you know They feel like It's a stupid question and you know Yes, I come from an educational background on like there's no stupid questions if you're wondering it the

[00:13:07] You boat partner or if there's another person's probably wondering the same thing and And you know to me like Someone like myself. I still hire guides in many locations like oh and part of the value and it is is you learn something most days

[00:13:21] So often I'm I'm kind of digging at like why are you doing this? What are you looking for right and those aren't those aren't bad questions to ask at all?

[00:13:30] Yeah, exactly you know asking how is a rigging at why he's rigging it that way? Why he's using a certain pattern? A lot of guys to they'll really break it down. They'll start showing you like they'll screen the river for you

[00:13:41] And show you why they're fishing that pattern show you the bugs that are swimming around But yeah, don't be scared I mean, you know you all got your secrets and everyone has their secrets on the river, but we're pretty open books, right?

[00:13:52] Yeah, it's our job. It's what we're there for teaching you. Yeah, and I think often you know There's a perception that like guides don't want to be teachers because they want to protect their job in the sense that

[00:14:04] You know if they teach you too much. They're gonna like coach you out of being one of their clients and honestly See it opposite right I have you have a lot of our guides have clients that are are very capable often

[00:14:18] They own their own boats and they fish on their own on this river, but they still see the value and hiring a guide or yeah Going out with a buddy and then they don't have to row or whatever it may be

[00:14:28] Yeah, that's trout fish and man every day can be different if it yeah, that way yeah And so you know you're gonna fish usually on a full-day situation You're gonna fish you know period of time in the morning

[00:14:41] You know rolling to lunch somewhere around that lunch hour new hour and then and then finish out the day So kind of standard protocol or you know I guess we'll enlighten a few people and how the end of the day usually works

[00:14:56] What are your thoughts there so you know we get to the ramp? You're gonna load up rig generally there like we'll have clients ask, you know, can we help? I'm assuming your response to that as much like my intro. Oh, thanks. I got this take at this

[00:15:14] Jumping the AC, no, no hang out drink a beer. Yeah A lot of guides have a checklist scenario right where we kind of have to make sure we do the same repetitive thing

[00:15:25] Right to make sure our boats buckled down and anchors taken off and rods are put away So, you know the end of the day often kind of you know We appreciate the offer to help and we're not trying to be rude by denying it

[00:15:37] But it's more like you know we want stuff put back a certain way We want to make sure that it's all secure and safe So if you can get you back to the lodge safely

[00:15:47] Yeah, especially with the crank in the boat up most of our cranks don't really work that well So you can get real real hurt if you don't have a trust right a little worn out

[00:15:55] Little worn out, so then we get we get back to the lodge or wherever you met the guy in the morning for us It's it's usually the lodge. So we get you back to the lodge We get a lot of questions of people are just kind of nervous

[00:16:09] Not sure how to handle the tipping scenario not sure what the norm is So someone industry standard kind of across a board doesn't really matter if your trout fishing or salt water fishing and somewhere in that 20% range 40% yeah 40% 50%

[00:16:26] We often explain it much like a really good waiter waitress right like if they did their job great It's meant to be a tip and if they earn more than that like and you think you'd like to give more than that by all means like

[00:16:40] If they've you know busted their ass and done what they're supposed to do It's a it's a great time to you know reward them for it But but often much like the you know any service industry People are counting on like that tip money is is

[00:16:59] In essence a big part of their income right yeah, that's what buys all the flies we lose and tip it and it helps out a lot Yeah, yeah So you know it is meant to be a tip and if they didn't earn it

[00:17:11] They didn't earn it right, but if they did a good job for you It's it's great to kind of reward them for it and something they're often kind of counting on so much greatly appreciated yeah

[00:17:22] And so generally from there. It's a you know tips and area by all means It's kind of a norm for a guide so don't be like worried about Have to be secretive about the tips sort of thing right no weird handshakes

[00:17:36] Yeah goofy handshakes not a drug deal slap someone on the back and secretly stuff in their pocket Right it doesn't have to be awkward it can sit in the text that night so it looks and looking your bizer. Yeah

[00:17:49] I had that one or the weirdest one I had one day I got put it in my wiper blades on the outside of my truck Which as your cruise and oh you're like wait a minute is there cash in the wife of way to my rig yeah

[00:18:02] Yeah, and then luckily. I don't think I lost any but yeah It that one took me by surprise right few more beers. We would have lost that yeah for sure for sure So so you know that just honest handshake, you know, thanks appreciate it sort of thing

[00:18:17] Hand off the tip money's great and then and then usually on your way though go obviously the guides are also a great resource if you're trying to enjoy You know night life or you're trying to enjoy a town or a good dinner

[00:18:30] They're obviously a great recommendation. You know, they usually a great resource to find out where where you should go I want to know the Davies bar to go to you just ask fish and guide

[00:18:40] Usually spot on and usually the best steak house to they got a pretty good idea where that might be So anything I miss anything you're thinking that I'm not I'm not hit not I think covered it all man so generally from there

[00:18:57] You know into the trip like we might have you know a lot of shops will reach out to you after the fact ask you for a review You know try to follow up with the trip obviously if they need to collect from you

[00:19:10] You know for the rest of the payment that's sort of thing It is becoming more and more standard that like Obviously shops will check in with you upfront about you know fishing licenses make sure you got them sort of thing

[00:19:22] but more and more states are you know requiring guides to Record down license numbers Stuff like that for permits. So you know the guides not trying to be snoopy if he asked to see your fishing license

[00:19:34] It's usually he's got to record your sports ones ID number down for For permitting purposes, right? So we trust you. We just gotta do it. Yeah exactly exactly so Yeah in the future if any of you'd listen and are tuning in with you know

[00:19:50] Have any more questions about you know top of like this feel free to you know hit us up You can always ask questions on our social media accounts were the podcast posted and we're happy to answer those in the future

[00:20:06] And you can always give us a ring here at the shop and we're happy to help so Social media stuff for you Troy working people reach you other than calling the ugly bug Got an Instagram and it's Troy underscore Pinkerton awesome Appreciate it. Thanks, man. Thank you

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